Tags
jealousy, Jean-Baptiste Lully, Les Fâcheux, Love Question, Molière, Pierre Beauchamp, Question d'amour, The Bores
I may not be able to post Les Fâcheux today. It would be too long a post. But I could indicate that in Les Fâcheux, first performed on 17 August 1661, at Vaux-le-Vicomte, Nicolas Fouquet‘s magnificent castle, the spectator/reader goes from bore to bore, all of whom want to talk to our hero, Éraste, a marquis who loves Orphise to whom he seems unable to catch up. He does catch up to her in an unexpected dénouement.
The play is therefore repetitive. Éraste is forever interrupted by bores. But one of the episodes, Act Two, Scene Four, features Éraste who is asked by Clymène and Orante, to play umpire, adjudicator, in a debate on whether jealousy is a sign of love.
C’est une question à vider difficile,/ Et vous devez chercher un juge plus habile
Éraste à Clymène et Orante (II. iv)
[That is a question difficult to settle; you had best look for a more skilful judge.]
Éraste to Clymène and Orante (II. 4)
Pour moi de son esprit j’ai trop bon témoignage,/ 400 Pour craindre qu’il prononce à mon désavantage./ Enfin ce grand débat qui s’allume entre nous,/ Est de savoir s’il faut qu’un amant soit jaloux.
Orante à Éraste (II. iv)
[For my part, I am too much assured of his sense to fear that he will decide against me. Well, this great contest which rages between us is to know whether a lover should be jealous.]
Orante to Éraste (II. 4)
Ou, pour mieux expliquer ma pensée et la vôtre,/ Lequel doit plaire plus d’un jaloux ou d’un autre.
Orante à Éraste (II. iv)
[Or, the better to explain my opinion and yours, which ought to please most, a jealous man or one that is not so?]
Orante to Éraste (II. 4)
405 Pour moi, sans contredit, je suis pour le dernier.
Clymène à tous (II. iv)
[For my part, I am clearly for the last.]
Clymène to all (II. 4)
Et dans mon sentiment je tiens pour le premier.
Orante à tous (II. iv)
[As for me, I stand up for the first.]
Orante to all (II. 4)
Je crois que notre cœur doit donner son suffrage,/ À qui fait éclater du respect davantage.
Orante à tous (II. iv)
445 Et je veux, qu’un amant pour me prouver sa flamme, Sur d’éternels soupçons laisse flotter son âme,/ Et par de prompts transports, donne un signe éclatant/ De l’estime qu’il fait de celle qu’il prétend./ On s’applaudit alors de son inquiétude,/ Et s’il nous fait parfois un traitement trop rude,/ Le plaisir de le voir soumis à nos genoux,/ 450 S’excuser de l’éclat qu’il a fait contre nous,/ Ses pleurs, son désespoir d’avoir pu nous déplaire, /Est un charme à calmer toute notre colère.
Orante à tous (II. iv)
[I would that a lover, in order to prove his flame, should have his mind shaken by eternal suspicions, and, by sudden outbursts, show clearly the value he sets upon her to whose hand he aspires. Then his restlessness is applauded; and, if he sometimes treats us a little roughly, the value he sets upon her to whose hand he aspires. Then his restlessness is applauded; and, if he sometimes treats us a little roughly, the pleasure of seeing him, penitent at our feet, to excuse himself for the outbreak of which he has been guilty, his tears, his despair at having been capable of displeasing us, are a charm to soothe all our anger.]
Clymène to all (II. 4)
Si pour vous plaire il faut beaucoup d’emportement,/ Je sais qui vous pourrait donner contentement;/ 455 Et je connais des gens dans Paris plus de quatre,/ Qui comme ils le font voir, aiment jusques à battre.
Orante à tous (II. iv)
[If much violence is necessary to please you, I know who would satisfy you; I am acquainted with several men in Paris who love well enough to beat their fair ones openly.]
Orante to all (IV. 4)
Éraste’s answer is:
Puisqu’à moins d’un arrêt je ne m’en puis défaire,
Toutes deux à la fois je vous veux satisfaire;
465 Et pour ne point blâmer ce qui plaît à vos yeux,
Le jaloux aime plus, et l’autre aime bien mieux.
Éraste to all (II. iv)
[Since I cannot avoid giving judgment, I mean to satisfy you both at once; and, in order, not to blame that which is pleasing in your eyes, the jealous man loves more, but the other loves more wisely.].
Éraste to all (IV. 4)
Who would appreciate reducing a man to sudden outbursts, applauding a man’s restlessness? Who would wish to be treated a little roughly and enjoy seeing the penitent at one’s feet, witness his tears and his despair?
If Clymène enjoys the pain she inflicts, we could perhaps put her on the same footing as our tormented and jaloux, or on the other side of the same coin. This is not love.
—ooo—
Molière, Jean-Baptiste Lully (music) and Pierre Beauchamp (ballet) performed their first comédie-ballet, Les Fâcheux, at Vaux-le-Vicomte. Les Fâcheux (The Bores) was then performed at the Théâtre du Palais-Royal, on 4 November 1661. In 1661, Molière’s troupe was la troupe de Monsieur, frère unique du Roi. The play’s main source is Horace‘s Satires. Les Fâcheux is a divertissement.
Love to everyone 💕
Provided to YouTube by CDBaby Courante De Mr. Lully · David Rogers, Joanna Blendulf & Laura Zaerr ℗ 2014 Daniel Stephens Released on: 2014-01-01 Auto-generated by YouTube.
© Micheline Walker
12 December 2019
WordPress
derrickjknight said:
The pain cannot be ignored, but there is no place for violence.
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michelinewalker said:
The pain cannot be ignored. Human beings are precious and it begins with one’s spouse. A couple/family is the nucleus in a society. As he tries to get together with Orphise, Éraste sees that he cannot be an angry husband. His journey, from bore to bore, takes him to a good wife who has watched him. Husbands and wives make another feel good about themselves. 🙂
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koolkosherkitchen said:
So the discussion regarding jealousy continues in this play. Incidentally, one of the quotations reminded me of Russian peasant women who would proudly display bruises inflicted upon them by their husbands, “If he beats me – he loves me.” Logically, then, other women would surmise that their husbands did not love them, since they hadn’t beaten them. Fascinating to see similar idea in a Moliere play.
Have a wonderful weekend, dear Micheline.
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michelinewalker said:
Yes, the discussion on jealousy is continued in Les Fâcheux, but it can be detached. Éraste goes from bore to bore, but this scene is longer and the matter of jealousy is discussed in one scene. As umpire, Éraste slows down a little and says, somewhat ambiguously, that the person who is not jealous is the better husband. Jealousy leads to violence, which does in Dom Garcie de Navarre. He gets very angry. Les Fâcheux, however, is a divertissement. A young lover may not be certain that a woman loves him but this uncertainty may be resolved. I am going back to my post.
Much love,
M
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koolkosherkitchen said:
Looking forward to further discussion, dear Micheline,
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michelinewalker said:
It’s done, but I had to deal with a sudden drop in white blood cells. I didn’t push myself. It’s a minor accident.
Much love my dear,
M
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koolkosherkitchen said:
I hope you are feeling better by now, dear friend!
Take care of yourself,
D
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michelinewalker said:
I’m feeling quite well, but I will have to be treated for this condition, which I do not like. Yesterday was a difficult day. My computer did not publish the final copy of my post on “Les Fâcheux” (2). I changed its status to privately published and corrected the post. The computer makes “dialogs.”
In 1924, the Diaghilev’s Ballets Russes made a ballet from “Les Fâcheux.” They also made a ballet using “Le Médecin malgré lui,” with music by Charles Gounod.
Love,
M
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koolkosherkitchen said:
I have seen costumes and sets for both Diaghilev ballets; thank you for reminding me of that wonderful experience, dear Micheline.
Much love,
D
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michelinewalker said:
Diaghilev operated miracles. He could find the right persons. His dancers were trained in Russia, in the grand tradition. I read today that Nikinsky was a small man. I would never have guessed.
Much love,
M
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koolkosherkitchen said:
Yes, Nijinsky was small, and at the same exhibition where we saw the costume and sets, they showed an old clip of NIjinsky dancing the Faun and another one of Nuriev in the same part. The comparison of two brilliant dancers with Bakst sets in the background made an indelible impression.
Russian ballet dancers are still trained in the tradition of Pavlova and Balanchine; they are still unsurpassed.
Love,
D
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michelinewalker said:
Dear D
I so admire Russian Ballet dancers. They undergo arduous training and are very disciplined. I could watch them for hours and I am pleased the new Russia respects this tradition and still prepares excellent skaters. As a child, I begged my mother to allow me to study ballet. She refused. I would be a pianist. When I shared my house with Tanya, she told me that it had been a mistake and that in Russia I would have had no choice. I grew to look like a ballerina and still do. My parents wanted me to a concert pianist and also had me study diction and drama. My plate was very full. I think Tanya was right, but in the end, I became a teacher and loved my profession. Was is destiny?
Love,
Micheline
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koolkosherkitchen said:
Your friend Tanya was right; in communist Russia you would have had no choice. Those Russian ballerinas you admire are taken away from their parents at the age of five or six. That’s when the arduous training starts. They have no childhood, no youth, and no life of their own. BY the age of 30, they can’t dance any more as their health is ruined and they are considered too old. The famous incredible Maya Plisetskaya who danced while in her 80s was unique.
The training and discipline has remained the same, but of course children are not taken away from parents without parental consent. The same applied to skaters and other athletes.
Much love,
D
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michelinewalker said:
I just watched Plisetskaya. What a gorgeous dancer. Tanya did tell me that I would not have been given a choice and would have been taken away from my parents. That was frightening. I am glad that this is no longer the case. But Russian dancers, skaters, gymnasts are still better trained than their counterparts in other countries. I so enjoyed Gordeeva and Grinkov. They were as one on the ice and moved quickly. They were paired by the state, but they enjoyed skating together and married. His death was so tragic. Here I am, somewhat away from Molière.
Love
M
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koolkosherkitchen said:
I am glad you have enjoyed the video. Plisetskaya was my idol for many years. Her husband Rodion Schedrin composed The Carmen Suite and Anna Karenina ballets for her, and she was unsurpassed in both.
I also loved Gordeeva and Grinkov, but they were still product of the old regime and old school of training. Even today, I don’t think any other country allocates this much of a budget on developing star ballet dancers, skaters, and athletes.
Much love,
D
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michelinewalker said:
Russia is so rich. By now Gordeeva and Grinkov belong to the past, but they were superb in their time. Current skaters are perhaps more athletic, acrobats. But Gordeeva and Grinko were charming. Ekaterina said that they had all the facilities they needed to train. Here, such facilities cost a great deal of money. Parents have to pay and most cannot afford the ice time. I used to skate, but never learned figure skating. Skating was simply pleasurable. I still have excellent blades, but the shoes have deteriorated.
As a child, I spent days skating. It was free, so were tennis courts and indoors swimming pools. The city paid, because most families were rather poor. These were simpler days. I’m a long-distance swimmer, but never competed. It was just pleasure.
Much love,
Micheline
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koolkosherkitchen said:
There is an excellent skating school in Odessa that has put out several champions who are supremely artistic, as well as athletic. Of course, the famous Tatiana Tarasova, the trainer of champions of old, now lives in New Jersey and trains those whose parents can afford the expenses.
I am not a winter sports girl; we didn’t really have winter, but instead, we had the Black Sea. I do swim, sail, and have engaged in other water sports, only for pleasure,
Love,
D
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michelinewalker said:
I am not surprised. Russia promoted talents. It was a little strick under the Communist régime, but Russia still promotes talents.
Much love,
M
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koolkosherkitchen said:
It was more than a little strict. In 1913, while still theorizing about the future revolution, Lenin wrote, “Every person will be a small bolt in a big government machine.” The communist regime was dehumanizing, and people were always treated as bolts, rather than humans. Russia promotes achievements, rather than talents, and searches for talents to generate achievements. It is still laboring under the inferiority complex first started by Peter the Great: Let’s show the world that we are not beneath them!
Love,
D
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michelinewalker said:
The link is included. It is in comments where it belongs.
Love,
Micheline
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koolkosherkitchen said:
I am glad you have found it useful, dear friend.
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michelinewalker said:
It had to be in the conversation. I never lift a link from another person, even if it is a YouTube link. It doesn’t seem polite. I’m working very hard on making this world a better place.
Much love,
Micheline
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koolkosherkitchen said:
You are doing your best, dear friend.
Love,
D
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michelinewalker said:
Yes, I am doing my very best because it starts a person at a time. But there may be inadvertent accidents.
Have a good day.
Much love,
Micheline
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koolkosherkitchen said:
Things happen to everyone, dear friend!
Have a great weekend,
D
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michelinewalker said:
We can do our best, nothing more.
Love,
Micheline
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michelinewalker said:
That is most unfortunate. Denying achievements would be wrong, but there are achievements we belittle. Being a fine wife and raising a good family are achievements. It seems there is nothing too small.
Much love,
Micheline
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koolkosherkitchen said:
I agree with you wholeheartedly.
Love,
D
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michelinewalker said:
It has always annoyed me that the work a mother does is not recognized as “work” by governments. My mother worked very hard. Those were the days when mothers ironed and repaired clothes. There are days when she went to market, at times with a child trailing, and days when she cleaned the house, all of the red brick house. We had two bathrooms, but no hot water. She never complained. Our friend Mariette Proumen came to visit and helped my mother make our clothes. Mariette and Henri became family the moment they arrived from Belgium. We were always together. They had no children, so we became their children. Mariette had been wardrobe mistress of the Belgian opera. She and my mother had long conversations while they worked, and we had the loveliest clothes children could have. They seldom bought new fabric. They recycled the perfect parts of adult clothes. I have great admiration for good mothers and for the persons who help. In fact, Mariette taught me how to design and sew clothes along with my grandmother.
Much love,
M
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koolkosherkitchen said:
I completely agree with you, dear Micheline.
Love,
D
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michelinewalker said:
To our mothers.
Love,
M
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koolkosherkitchen said:
In my case, grandmothers as well.
Much love,
D
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michelinewalker said:
And grandmothers. We need to protect the family. It is the central element in our society.
Much love,
Micheline
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koolkosherkitchen said:
Absolutely so!
Happy holidays, dear MIcheline!
All my love and many blessings,
D
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michelinewalker said:
Happy holidays to you too and to your family. I’m writing a post, but we have a celebration and I must get ready. We’ve nearly done all of Molière. France has a little site for me.
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koolkosherkitchen said:
Thank you, dear Micheline! Enjoy your holiday celebration!
Much love,
D
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michelinewalker said:
Best to you always.
Much love,
M
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koolkosherkitchen said:
Likewise!
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michelinewalker said:
It’s done, but I had problems. I publish the final copy, but earlier copies kept coming to the surface. The dénouement is quite special. The young lover is his own saviour. Damis is Orchise’s uncle, but he planned to have thugs kill Éraste. Ironically, the thugs turn against Damis whose life is saved by Éraste.
Much love,
M
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koolkosherkitchen said:
I am looking forward to reading it, dear Micheline. I am a few days behind, due to the tragic incident at Barnard college where my granddaughter is a freshman. Fortunately, she was not there at the time, but the senseless murder has affected all of us.
Much love,
D
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